I've created an even "tougher" version of MDE's Advanced Assault mod, which can be had from my server:

>>> Advanced Assault 2 mod <<<

Value key: my mod (MDE's mod) --

• name "Human base defense", member_min 15 (10)
• name "Cyborg base defense", member_min 12 (8)
• name "Psionic base defense", member_min 12 (8)
• name "Cultist assault", member_min 10 (7)
• name "Cultist base defense", member_min 18 (12)
• name "Wargot assault", member_min 12 (8)
• name "Wargot Myrmecol defense", member_min 12 (8)
• name "Starghost assault", member_min 14 (9)
• name "Reticulan remnants beasts", member_min 8 (5)
• name "Mutant beasts", member_min 8 (5)
• name "Militia base", member_min 3 (2)
• name "Wargot help", member_min 8 (4)
• name "Reticulan expedition", member_min 8 (4)
• name "Wargot Laputa assault", member_min 10 (7)
• name "Mutant assault", member_min 8 (5)
• name "Mutant Biomass defense", member_min 6 (4)
• name "Cultist Temple defense", member_min 20 (15)
• name "Laputa rebels", member_min 8 (4)
• name "Human hostages", member_min 8 (4)
• name "Cyborg hostages", member_min 8 (4)
• name "Psionic hostages", member_min 8 (4)
• name "Cyborg recruits", member_min 8 (6)
• name "Psionic recruits", member_min 8 (6)
• name "Human resource defense", member_min 8 (5)
• name "Cyborg resource defense", member_min 8 (5)
• name "Psionic resource defense", member_min 8 (5)
• name "Cultist resource defense", member_min 8 (7)
• name "Human help", member_min 8 (4)
• name "Cyborg help", member_min 8 (4)
• name "Psionic help", member_min 8 (4)
• name "Human base defense broken", member_min 8 (4)
• name "Cyborg base defense broken", member_min 8 (4)
• name "Psionic base defense broken", member_min 8 (4)
• name "Human resource defense broken", member_min 8 (4)
• name "Cyborg resource defense broken", member_min 8 (4)
• name "Psionic resource defense broken", member_min 8 (4)
• name "Wargot Myrmecol defense threads", member_min 10 (9)

woah, those numbers are pushing what I did for myself o_o tried upping the max?

Time for my Technician Terrors to unleash their LLLs!

(BTW, I went to a chinese restaurant recently, and on the back of their "sanitary towel" wrapper there was a description for Shanghai Little Dragon Buns(?) which read: " . . . ubiquitous little bundle of joy . . . ". I was like, OMGROFLMAO.

XD)

Like we say in Holland : "Niet te zuinig !".

An expression you use when things might have gone just a teeniewienee bit too far

Cheers,
Lodewijk

Is this simlar to alien assault 2? if so how does it differ?

See my post at the top of the thread ...

erm thats just a load number and load jargon of comparision to MDE's mod, which i also know nothing about except for the fact it 'adds more enermies'


and hence they is no comparison to alien assault 2 mod, and hence i still no wiser

If you go to MDE's website, he explains that he's directly copied (without change) Alien Assault 2 into his Advanced Assault. My version is built on MDE's, so the "MDE" numbers are the same as those of Alien Assault 2. Hence, when you compare mine versus MDE's, you're also comparing against Alien Assault 2. In case it's not obvious, I'm only upping (further) the MINIMUM numbers (compared to the other mods).

Dost thou see a ray of sunlight yet?

From my website: "number of enemies more (average, not max) than in "Alien Assault Mod". "

The following example is an example of the changes:

Unmodded: "Human base defense", member_min 10, member_max 14

Alien Assault 2: "Human base defense", member_min 1, member_max 20

MDE: "Human base defense", member_min 10, member_max 20

ShadowWarriors: "Human base defense", member_min 15, member_max 20

Average Enemies:

Unmodded: 12
Alien Assault 2: 10
MDE: 15
ShadoWarrior: 17.5

Thanks, MDE. I had forgotten that you'd increased some of the min numbers over those in Alien Assault. I was only looking at your max numbers versus his. Sorry.

I may increase the max numbers, depending on how the game feels to me. So far, the numbers appear comfortable.

With your WeaponRebalanceMod should be an increase of the max numbers from 20 to 30 comfortable also.

I have tried many ways to get a challenge from this game - but there is no way. It's lame.

Waiting for "Heros of MM 5" and "Oblivion" :-)

It is possible to make AS challenging (what you and I consider a challenge, anyway), but it requires a huge amount of effort. Until I have easy access to the DB for change purposes, I'm unwilling to put forth the amount of time I need to make the game hard for me. But what I can do is make the game sufficiently hard for most everyone else (and a true nightmare for those that find the unmodded game at 'Veteran' too hard).

I'll probably bump the numbers up to 30 sometime this weekend. The more the merrier. Ammo is cheap ...

PS - I, too, am waiting for Oblivion. Been waiting for it for years.

I agree. Access to the DB and a little more information would be helpful. But the essential problem is the AI. You can play Aftershock with shotguns only and there is no challenge, because you can out-maneuver the enemies.

It's likely as in "Jagged Alliance 2". You cannot mod a challenge. But then they released the source code and I could code the essential things. Wow, funny game.

"Age of Empires" had a bad AI also and was no challenge, but the AI was scripted and I could mod the AI to make the game fun.

Afershock is lacking the possibility to mod the really important things. Maybe, with the DB, all needed information and much try and error .... but that needs to much time - I have a job and a family and modding is only a hobby.

BTW, with max 30 you need 30 ammo factories :-)

That's what I love about HOI/HOI2 (from Paradox). You have full access to the AI and most everything else in the game. No other company exposes more of their internals than Paradox.

You play the same games as me. But that's a good idea. Maybe I play my old HOI2 with the new patch - and maybe a little modding :-)

Folks, try this one on for fun ...

>>> Heroic Assault mod <<<

nee wees vooral niet te zuinig

Which my browser's translator renders as "not too economical"? Seems like something is getting very much lost in the translation ...

yeah, dutch to english (or the other way around for that matter) often comes out very wrong
direct translations almost always fail to bring the correct meaning across

so it's best to just trust us on it's meaning ;-p

Would be easier to do if either of you had let those of us who don't speak Dutch in on the meaning ...

(grumble) Why couldn't they pick one of the four languages I can read? (grumble)

he did:


it could be roughly translated into "don't be too picky!" but it doesn't do the expression any justice (it's usually used when someone takes too much of something leaving nothing for others, but even this description doesn't do it justice)

as to why not one of those four: expressions always work better in ones native language, more so for those difficult/impossible to translate types

Not too economical, in a nation famous for being calvinistic moneyhoarding cheapasses (hence the expression 'let's do dutch when splitting the bill'), is an expression of mild horror and shock - usually because something is being (way) overdone. It is only used in an exclamation of amazement and/or suprise. A requirement for use is a humorous context. It has overtones of the regular American 'Cool !' in the context of things being blown up for no particular reason whatsoever. Perhaps the nearly extinct 'Fab !' would be a better comparison. Cultural expressions never translate well (did some research at the uni on auto-translating and it's a horribly difficult subject to my amazement). I've never seen a decent auto-translation of a Dutch (or any other language) text ever.

When I read the numbers of this mod, for a dutch guy, there was only one thing to say that fit those numbers

I'll stick to English from now on and confine myself to "radical, dude, that's some hefty opposition if I read these numbers right "

Cheers,
Lodewijk

EDIT : I see ShadowKeeper and I have crossposted, so for all clarity, he is talking about the use of this phrase as an everyday expression and I am talking about he use as an exclamation (hence the "!").

great numbers in the heroic assault mod SW made my cheatmod-ed game more of a balance

...and besides, its always fun to own numbers greatly outnumbering you

that's because I'm only a neighbour Lodewijk (huphup België ) we use the phrase more for daily stuff
(de woorden, gierige hollander komen ter gedachte (no offence ) (for a translation: the words "greedy dutchman" come to mind )

You know I love the flemish accent, with the soft 'g'. I really should move to Brabant where they talk like that. Here in Holland the accent is horrid, so 'flat'. I myself am said to be one of the 'flattest' speakers around, to my embaressement. And we really lose out if we start talking beer

Cheers,
Lodewijk

Can you two Dutchmen take it to PM, please? You're badly hijacking this thread ...

thx

apologies SW, got carried away a bit

ahh yes, one's own nationalism towards one's country...

say, thats an idea of a effect for troops similar to the leadership skills effects

Likewise my apologies.

Cheers,
Lodewijk

Apologies accepted, not that they were necessary. thx

One of the many things I like about Europeans is that they still teach manners (for the most part) over there, whereas here in the States they are sadly all too lacking.

Damn, now you've got *me* going off-topic.

I hope no-one encorporates that into a mod. We can do with less "polite europeans" in games at the moment.

Really? The last game I played that had any Europeans was Deus Ex and most of them were trying to kill me ...

The European team members in JA2 aren't especially polite. Most of the Europeans in HOI don't like me (but that tends to happen when you play as Germany).

Wait, I have played two other, more recent games, with Europeans: Call of Duty and Silent Storm. In both you either have polite (but pushy) Brits, or really pissed off Germans (and Russians, which don't like you even though they're on the same side).

All in all, I would welcome a few polite Europeans in my games.

Russians aren't really european, they are more Asian. (i prefer Risk to real life economics)

Are there any modifications to experience reward system by Heroic Assault mod (as in Alien Assault v2 mod) or this mod only increases numbers of enemies ?

EDIT: ok, solved.

I'm running a Superhuman level Heroic Assault + Weapon Rebalance 3.08 game, and I would like to commend SW for his work so far! I'm a XCOM 1, 2 and 3 vet and have 2.5 years experience as an infantry scout/recon, and yet I've already lost 5 people in 3 missions, and that's just against Reticulans.

The difficulty is sweet... now even a broken wooden table matters as cover when I would have previously ignored it. Cover and movement is now crucial, as a delay in firing first would quickly mean guys going down. Taking (and holding!) a strong point is also far more important than before, as the enemy attacks in force.

The platoon-sized "assist local forces" missions are now far better and have a lot more atmosphere and feel (I don't mug locals, just to make it harder for myself). I just had a 13 cyborgs plus my 5 man team vs 28 mutants game. Managed to hold a 2 story apartment block in some bitter room to room fighting... at the end of the battle, mutants and 10 dead cyborgs littered the area.

Great work SW.

Man, I am running a normal difficulty game with WR 3.08 and AA2 mods... it kicks ass!

Last night I played a cultist base mission - my 4 men (i try to send as little squads as possible, to get more XP) whacked 38, that's thirty eight cultists! There were some memorable scenes there alright

Brilliant work, SW!

P.S.: And on the XP question - did you mod the XP system in AA2? I am pretty sure that the more outnumbered I am, the more XP I get.

So folks, how has the Heroic Assault mod stood up to the test of time? I plan to start a max diff + WR + HA game once I finish this one. Mainly I want to know if the same builds hold up. Assuming that the leader auras and ambidextrous chipset are still bugged, I was planning on this:

Cyborg Commando/Ranger
-- Dual d-wakizashis and needlers. Max durability. Leads melee assaults
Psi Commando/Ranger
-- Dual d-wakizashis and needlers. Brings special effects to the party. Right behind the melee leader.
Human Scout/Stalker/Ranger
-- Search with a little bit of destroy destroy. Max stealth. Close range backup. Human female for stealth bonus.
Human Technician/Gunman/Sniper
-- Really can't think of a third class that would help, but being human, he can easily carry that sniper rifle for tough targets. Probably a meson rifle.
Human Medic/Technician/Scout
-- Cloaked medic and heavy weapon/deployable support. Female for the stealth bonus.
Cyborg Sniper/Scout
-- Cloaked sniper and secondary scout, he gets into position where it might otherwise be dangerous. HP lets him survive if caught.
Psi Sniper/Medic
-- Supportive special effects. This is the one the civilians will follow. The psi effects she provides, do they help non-Laputian friendly characters, too?

Now, a question. Stalker's Enemy Anatomy lets you critical more, Commando's final ability lets you close fast. With so many enemies, I'm thinking the Commando's going to be more useful. So, Scout for the Stealth bonus and eventual use of cloak/group cloak? Which reminds me. *posts in WR thread*

Should I have more snipers? I've fallen in love with gauss autocannons, and mow down non-priests/mechs by targeting the back of an enemy grouping or the ground behind them. Needlers are my #2 favorite toy, have to watch ammo usage though.

What does that mod change in regards to experience? Is it experience per enemy you kill? or per mission?
Some other calculations maybe?

Thanks,
Oyster!

Both.

Don't think the assault mod will make things alot tougher, only in the beginning it might since you got crap equip and your outmanned drastically.

In the end when you got a well decked out team, 4 snipers + med + 2 spearhead gun runners it becomes same old same.

Can I add one of these mods in a game in progress? For example if I start playing with only the weapon rebalance mod at veteran and later decide I want more challenge but don't want to restart.

Yes.

SW,

I am not sing the WBM yet (I will soon though, just taking it step by step again)... but yesterday evening, I decided to put this mod in, as I was seriously running low on ammo... and I had a reticulan mission comming up. MY COD THAT WAS TEH FUN!!! I think I shot something like 25 aliens, and it took me more than an hour to proceed to that slaughter... I didn't know exactly how many to expect... so I was moving on that map with my four troopers...crawling inch by inch, spotting... positioning and ambushing. *insert evil smile here*. I finished that mission with no less that 28 clips (I somehow wish those aliens would take more than one clip with them).

Good stuff! *thumbs up*

Just wait until you run into twice as many Wargots as you're used to. Better yet, with my WR and Heroic Assault mods, twice as many that are also tougher and can hit what they aim at. {evil grin}

Can you remove it if you think it's TOO challenging?

Only the heroic assault mod.

as far as experience is concerned, is it safe to say troops will gain more experience per mission with this mod? seeing as there are so many more enemies to deal with? ie, XP earned per enemy killed?

or will it still be the same XP advances as from standard missions?


also, are the enemy numbers always very high? or is it randomised so that some missions only MIGHT have more than 10... i kinda like the idea that the numbers are not fixed, so u can't really prepare for every battle as if it will be a major firefight cos u just don't know.
er... if this isn't the case then would u consider doing a 'randomised numbers of enemy' version of this mod? i just think that level of unpredictability would do wonders for pre mission tension:-
eg, running low on 7.62 ammo for the M60s so do u risk using MP5s and shotguns in the hope that there will be low numbers of enemies? [i understand there are lots of tactical options to dealing with mssions - like using stealth and cover to kill quietly and not being seen, or setting up ambushes - but it's just an example] then , on landing, u are facing scores of aliens, putting you in an Aliens2 type scenario... YEHHHH! [i can almost hear Vasquez pulling the pin on that plasma grenade, acid-burn scars down her face, yelling 'fuck you!!!' as it explodes and vapourises 4 brainmen about to feast on her gizzards]

i love the idea of facing scores of enemies as it's getting a bit samey bumping off 3-8 bad guys every mission. i just don't like the idea of facing scores every time. i mean, some areas are bound to only have light resistance... right?

i just hope it doesn't get too difficult when capturing cleric's!

das

Well, it seems this mod and Advanced Assault 2 mod aren't compatible with tutorial missions (or maybe just one, second(?) mission) - game crashes on 17%, during create new game. The problem somewhere with these values in squad.txt:



Reverting values to defaults (min = 7, max = 7) fixes the problem. ShadoWarrior, please check it out.

PS. And greetings to community

Gotta say this mod makes life interesting...

I did a combined Wargot-Cultist base defense last night.

The good:
*39* (that's thirty-nine!) bad guys on the 'inside' level of the base. I don't know how many were outside (this time) because I high-tailed it straight for the elevator (first time I tried the outside, my guys started in the guardhouse just behind the towers and basically couldn't fight their way out).

The bad:
My guys started the inside in a bathroom. That's merely amusing; what was *bad* is that the game put 3 of them in stalls, which they were unable to exit even after opening the doors. Urgh! This is worse than the power armor being stuck in a room (which was again more amusing than anything else). I'm not sure why Altar thought creating doors too small for the bigger units (or units too big for some doors; take your pick) was a good idea. At least a grenade blew one of the three clear, so I was only down two squaddies for most of the mission.

The ugly:
The BEATDOWN I handed out! Nearly everyone took injuries, but noone died (and no reloading required after that first bad start on the outside). I *definitely* learned why having quick-to-fire weapons available is (or I should say, would have been) nice, though - my two LaserMG's didn't get a single shot off until I broke out of that starting room and had a hallway to work with. But, conversely, being able to 'spray' the MGs at a crowded hallway (by targeting the enemies at the back) was very nice also - combined arms FTW!

From my testing the experience system sucks. From the previous posts I though great 600xp per mission I'm going to level really fast, so I installed the heroic assault mod and started a new game at veteran (wanted to play the whole game with it) in the very first mission i got 15 mutants, killed them (barely) noone of the 4 ppl died though and I got 58xp ??? while in normal game first misson I'm getting 4-5 mutants and I get 80-100xp. But 58 is definitely not 600 So it's no point playing it when there is even less xp reward than standart game.